P-61
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I am as the handle suggests, well past mid-life. My main interests lie in the WWII era, both American and German aircraft. I have recently met a crew member of a P-61 and want to make a model of his A/C. One problem is that it was a P-61A with no turret. Fine there, but what was in the gunner's compartment? Was it missing the seat as well as the sight? The gentleman in question does not know. Apparently like now, you were assigned a duty station on the A/C and that is all you dealt with. You did not poke around into the others' areas of responsibility. You did your job and did it well. Thanks.
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Welcome to the hangar, I put together this thread.
LINK - http://www.axis-and-allies-paintworks.com/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?420
Which is recognised here LINK - http://www.maam.org/p61.html
They are currently restoring a P-61 to flight (which you are probably aware of), maybe they can assist in your question.
Although I would think that the compartment was the same, as the reason why some P-61A's did not get the turret was due to the fact of the urgency for the same turret on the B-29, which was the most expensive and complicated weapon system in WWII, & took presidence.
Regards Duggy. -
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A lot of P-61 crews had the turret removed in the field to reduce weight, so it may be, that the crewmember you talked to never even SAW a turret on a P-61... If the turret was removed, the redundant gunner would be absent as well... The Germans used one man Ju-87 Stuka's in regards to the Ju-87R...A long range version of the Ju-87B...the gunner was added weight... In the P-61, the turret never lived up to it's expectations, and was promptly removed by depot mechanics before delivery to squadron use....too much weight for too little advantage... Welcome to A&A!..
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Sturmvogel
... the redundant gunner would be absent as well... The Germans used one man Ju-87 Stuka's in regards to the Ju-87R...A long range version of the Ju-87B...the gunner was added weight...
Hi Sturmvogel,
interesting statement. I have done (and still do) a very lot of stuka research for my forthcoming project and i have never heard or read of this. May i ask for your sources?
Thank you very much
Armin -
Quote "A lot of P-61 crews had the turret removed in the field to reduce weight, so it may be, that the crewmember you talked to never even SAW a turret on a P-61"
I have never seen, or heard of this, the European birds were shipped to Liverpool without the turret,& in the Pacific there were field mods, where the top turret was fixed, and had different streamlining/panels.
But I have never heard of them being removed for weight saving???
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Thanks for the information. This particular A/C was constructed without a turret and one was never added. The 418th also had 61As and Bs both with(some fixed) and without them. It was a mixed bag. I was initially surprised that the RO did not know what was 10 feet in front of him. Nice to learn that the Ju87R was a one man crew. It is surprising the information that is out there.
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Duggy, I may be wrong, but many P-61's went into action without the turret..I assumed that this must have been done at a delivery depot, as opposed to an actual squadron doing this...As an old M-1 Abrams tanker, I have had turrets removed from the tank hull, but only by depot personnel...Battalion maintenance could not do that...and I assume that neither could a combat wing in WWII....
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cheruskerarmin... Here are a few sources....
Stukas over the Steppe by Peter C. Smith Stackpole Books
Hitler's Stuka Squadron's by John Ward "Eagles of War" www.motorbooks.com
Luftwaffe Squadrons in N. Africa by Osprey Aviation
The Great Book of WWII Airplanes by Bonanza Books... produced by Wing and Anchor Press a division of Zokeisha Publications, LTD
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Also, simply look up the Ju-87R Stuka.... It was basically a Ju87B that carried a single SC-250 bomb on the centerline and two external droptanks.. One under each wing.. The gunner was left behind, even though his "station" in the plane was still there..Less weight means range... This is not made up...This Stuka version existed and was most prevalent in North Africa and other parts of the Med Theater...
